Daytime skies in HDR

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[Bsmooth]

Shooting lots of HDR's,hopefully practice does make you better.But I'm having problems with skies during the day being noisy or splotchy.I thought maybe I wasn't covering enough with my 3 exposures at 2 EV apart,so I increased it to 6 exposures.I set the AEB to the usual 2 EV apart then moved it down so that the high mark was in the center and taking 3,then moving it to the right and having the low mark in the center.You do get one shot thats a repeat ,but that can just be eliminated.
 Well after all that I still had the same issue anyway,so that didn't fix the problem.I am trying to blend the exposures using Trey Ratcliff's method,but the blending doesn't seem to match very well. Let me try to explain.
 When you open all the images in Photoshop(Images from Raws,and HDR from Photomatix),then you copy and paste from lightest to darkest,with Photomatix on top.Then you do a reveal all mask,and start belending going down one image at a time and then merge then a new mask again.
 But heres the weird part,when I go over the area with the brush,the images don't seem to be lined up very well.Say I go over a tree against a sky,when I go over it with the brush its not in the same place !Right now to copy I get on an image and select all and copy,then go to the next image and paste it.
 After that I go to Layers,then layer mask ,reveal all and select the brush size and set opacity to 0 to 10,depending on the situation.
 I just don't know why the images don't seem to line up.When you brush over shouldn't the images be exactly lined up so your not seeing double images?

[SpiffyPix]

Hmmmm.....

I'm having a bit of trouble following you.  Let's see if I have the gist.  You're saying that you're merging the bracketed exposures through photomatix and then layering the merged photos with the orig RAW photos in PS, correct?

My first question, are you using a tripod? Are you on shutter priority or Aperture priority?  It should be Aperture priority.

Also, if your problem is that the clouds are not lining up, remember that you have the combined motion of the earth and clouds moving, so you might be a little off from that.

Also, I think that when you merge the RAW files to a radiance (.hdr) file, the program does some slight cropping (although I don't know why, exactly).  I wonder if that is affecting your line-up of images?

I know that there is a function in PS that automatically lines up photos as they are layered, but I don't know the command.  Can anyone give us that PS command?

Mel

[Bsmooth]

Yes I'm using a tripod,and my 20D is in aperture Priority.Clouds don't seem to be an issue,but the sky sure is.
I've been following your rough tutorial as well and when I move the micro-smoothing below 2 or 3 the sky tends to get a lot of noise or sort of a spackly look.
 As far as the RAW files I usually process them in the RAW converter in Photoshop,before I merge them with the HDR file.
 I've tried both methods of stacking,being the one I mentioned of copy and paste,but I also tried the move arrow along with the Shift key to automatically align the images.But I still get that wierd doubling when I brush over the images after there stacked using the layer mask.

[dddphoto]

To align layers in PS use File - Scripts - Load Files into Stack. It will then bring up a menu for choosing your images and a check box to automatically aligning the source images. A simpler way is to just adjust the opacity of the top layer and manually move to align on the bottom layer.

In Photomatix you have the option of cropping or not when creating the HDR. Since all the raw images are the same exact size, any movement with aligning will cause some uncommon image area. If the image is not cropped it will increase the size of the HDR image. Hope that makes sense.

[SpiffyPix]

I knew someone here would have the answer.   

mel

[Bsmooth]

I'm not sure about the script load in stack.I just don't seem to have it in Photoshop CS.But I did do an experiment I loaded the images in icluding he HDR one and then proceeded to go to each layer I wanted copied and select all then copy then going onto the layer I wanted it on and pasted it,going from lightest to darkest.Still had the offending double image problem.
 So I tried the stacking using the move tool and holding down the Shift key to align it. Voila,no more double images !
 So I cannot use the copy and paste method I guess,because it plain just doesn't work.

[DAVE RHUBERG]

Are you using your lowest ISO, and are you using RAW/TIFF?
High ISO and JPEG can introduce artifacts in large plain areas of smooth tone.

[Bsmooth]

I am using RAW,as many of you have already mentioned it seems to be the way to go.As far as ISO, I'm shooting at 200.I probably should shoot at 100,but I like the extra light I can get,but that is a possibility thats for sure.

[msavad]

Shooting lots of HDR's,hopefully practice does make you better.But I'm having problems with skies during the day being noisy or splotchy.I thought maybe I wasn't covering enough with my 3 exposures at 2 EV apart,so I increased it to 6 exposures.I set the AEB to the usual 2 EV apart then moved it down so that the high mark was in the center and taking 3,then moving it to the right and having the low mark in the center.You do get one shot thats a repeat ,but that can just be eliminated.
 Well after all that I still had the same issue anyway,so that didn't fix the problem.I am trying to blend the exposures using Trey Ratcliff's method,but the blending doesn't seem to match very well. Let me try to explain.
 When you open all the images in Photoshop(Images from Raws,and HDR from Photomatix),then you copy and paste from lightest to darkest,with Photomatix on top.Then you do a reveal all mask,and start belending going down one image at a time and then merge then a new mask again.
 But heres the weird part,when I go over the area with the brush,the images don't seem to be lined up very well.Say I go over a tree against a sky,when I go over it with the brush its not in the same place !Right now to copy I get on an image and select all and copy,then go to the next image and paste it.
 After that I go to Layers,then layer mask ,reveal all and select the brush size and set opacity to 0 to 10,depending on the situation.
 I just don't know why the images don't seem to line up.When you brush over shouldn't the images be exactly lined up so your not seeing double images?

the problem with shooting things outside is --- they move.

tree's, flowers, plants, clouds - they all move even for a fraction of an amount. so when you edit these, you have to find the layer that has the best colors, and fade it in, a pen helps alot. when i shoot people i use that method. also use the difference method to line things up in fractions of an amount, everything has to register perfectly. inside shots should be fine, it's just the outside stuff that won't line up. make to line it up on things that don't move at all like a rock or something.


---Mike Savad

[Bsmooth]

Whats the difference method? I am now using Photoshop 3 to do my merging to HDR,then taking that into PhotoMatix.is there a way to micro move images to align them somehow in Photoshop,while merging them into an HDR?

[msavad]

Whats the difference method? I am now using Photoshop 3 to do my merging to HDR,then taking that into PhotoMatix.is there a way to micro move images to align them somehow in Photoshop,while merging them into an HDR?

bring them in photoshop first - always - stack them, then on the top layer choose difference in the layers palette. you'll see ghosts of things that don't belong. nudge each layer so it looks flat (not embossed). i found that photoshop doesn't always do a great job aligning things and sometimes you have to do it 3 or 4 times before it fine tunes it. just be sure to align the layers on something that did not move at all. like a lamp, or a post or something. then once aligned make 3 extra copies, erasing each of the layers that make up an hdr - flatten it, save it as a tiff, then run those through photomatix. i don't let photomatix ever touch the alignment because it does a really terrible job most of the time. leaving cut line artifacts. you can also stitch panorama hdr's with this method.



---Mike Savad

[SpiffyPix]

Every time I read a post like this, I realize that there's so much that I don't know about Photoshop.  The difference method...I didn't even know that it existed!  Thanks.

Mel

[msavad]

Every time I read a post like this, I realize that there's so much that I don't know about Photoshop.  The difference method...I didn't even know that it existed!  Thanks.

Mel

i don't know if you could call it a method per se, but it's what i use. you can also use a fade method, but it's harder because it ghosts


---Mike Savad